Obviously this is a different cartridge type, but also our 6mmBR barrel end length was 5 longer than Rifleshooter.coms .308 Win start length. lb Muzzle Velocity ft/sec. However, testing indicates it may not be as much as initially thought. This resulted in a velocity loss of 106 feet/second. The cuts were made in one-inch intervals with a rotary saw. Last week I found out Cerakote has a color called USMC Red. Great test ! Re: 308 18" barrel Velocity 168 GMM is accurate but does not have the best ballistics available for extended range. pistols are measured, but revolvers are measured as the length of the barrel in front of 0. While this may sound contradictory, it isnt. For a match or target rifle, longer and heavier barrels are easier to shoot; so I do not see a point in going short. You may not reproduce original text or photos without advanced permission in writing. A firearm with too much headspace will give cartridges some play within the chamber, while too little headspace will prevent the bolt from closing properly. Shilen .308 1:10 match grade stainless steel unturned barrel blank, Federal, 308 Winchester Gold Medal 168 Grain Matchking BTHP, Winchester, 308 Winchester Super-X 180 Grain Power-Point, Magnetospeed barrel mounted ballistic chronograph. I got the longest blank I could and went from there. Without his help all of this would have Obviously, the amount of pressure a thin-skinned brass or steel casing can withstand is incredibly immense. Compare the above rates of loss to those found in 308 Winchester / 7.62x51mm NATO: Barrel Length versus Velocity (28 to 16.5), where the Winchester 147 grain FMJ averaged 24.6 feet/second per inch of barrel, IMI 150 grain FMJ averaged 22.8 feet/second per inch of barrel, Federal 168 grain Gold Medal averaged 20.9 feet/second per inch of barrel Red Oak, White, or Chestnut for Deer Herd? polygonal rifling + Because of the arc of travel of the bullet you will hit dead center at 50 and 200 yards with a 50 yard zero. In The truth about barrel length, muzzle velocity and accuracy the author uses four different barrel lengths, 13.5, 16, 18 and 26.5, and eight different cartridges. So it's not a shocker that the .308 would be a good cartridge. Furthermore, the If you have a modern .308 Win. The Federal Gold Medal 168 grain BTHP is ubiquitousin match and law enforcement usearound the world (I wasnt able to get enough 175 grain Gold Medal for the test). The 180 grain .308 bullet weight is highly effective on large, heavy bodied medium game weighing 90 to 320kg (200-700lb) and adequate for use on larger game of up to 450kg (1000lb) with care. The heavier weight and newer designed 175gr Sierra . When we cut our 6mmBR barrel down from 33 to 28, we only lost about 8 FPS per inch. So what works best? When you switch this out with a .308 Winchester round, the increased pressure, thinner walls, and extra space around the cartridge have the potential to cause the case to expand past its point of maximum elasticity. That works out to an average loss of 22.7 fps per inch. Read on, and it will all make sense. The testers described their procedure as follows: Ballistic data was gathered using a Magnetospeed barrel mounted ballistic chronograph. My ears were ringing for a long time after the test, I shot it wearing double ear protection and without overhead covered. While we have went to great lengths to make sure that it's as accurate as possible this rendering should not be used to generate specs for casings. While the external dimensions of both 7.6251 and .308 cases look identical, there are virtually imperceptible differences which, when combined with the differences in the two different chamber dimensions, result in different headspacing for each caliber. *Casing image above is an artist rendering and not a real photo of .308 Winchester (7.62mm NATO) Ballistics cartridge. Anyone who uses our data owes him With the .30 caliber bullet diameter being translated as 7.62 millimeters, the new 7.62x51mm cartridge was born. Trajectory for Custom .308 165 TGK #4667 AMMO at 2680 Feet per Second. Maybe ask the doctorate students at MIT. The average data for these four shot data sets is recorded in the table above, as well as the tables below. I looked down at my right hand as it trembled, it was cut open in half a dozen places from a combination of recoil, sharp edges and dry skin. You can then also add atmospheric conditions and angles. Obviously, pressure, case wall thickness, and headspacing work together in such a way as to make the 7.6251 NATO and the .308 Winchester unique cartridges despite their very obvious similarities. The IMI 150 grain FMJ 7.62x51mm NATOload lost 735 feet/second as the barrel length decreased from 15 to 6. Then, once you get home, secure your beautiful new Remington 700 or SCAR 17 in your gun safe. A Shooting 320 rounds off a chassis on your first outing you get a feel for things. Need help keeping it straight? Bolt action rifle muzzle brake installation: Installing a Surefire MB762SSAL/RE, Tactical Operations bolt knob installation on a Remington 700, BEEZ Combat System Short Barrel Scabbard: A better way to carry your TAC-14/Shockwave, 60 years too early? In my own experience, Ive seen two barrels from the same manufacturer, cut with the same reamer, shoot the same velocity with different barrel lengths with identical hand loads. Is the reverse possible? This chart shows velocity changes for all four ammo varieties: Summary of Findings: 7.62 NATO (a.k.a., 7.62x51mm) and .308 Winchester are two very common rifle cartridges commonly used by U.S. service members and civilians. Published Mar 29, 2021 12:55 PM EDT. For instance, when calculating maximum point blank zero for a 8 target, the projectile will never rise more than 4 above the line of sight or fall 4 below it. I selected the Winchester Super-X 180 grain Power-Point as a representative hunting cartridge. site designed and maintained by Coeurbois Graphic Design. What do you think of the MDT LSS chassis? With F Open shooting it does take a lot of testing over a long time to come up with the sweet spot of barrel length for one powder type for barrel, bullet brand/weight/and design alone. ALL Bulletin content is copyrighted, 2023 AccurateShooter.com. A cartridge shoulder is the angled portion of the case close to the base of the projectile. was measured from the end of the barrel back to the breech face. Do you see any use for a 10 308 Winchester? Average velocity loss from 28 to 16.5, was 24.6 ft/sec per inch for the Winchester 147 grain FMJ, 22.8 ft/sec per inch for the IMI Samson 150 grain FMJ, 20.9 ft/sec for the Federal Gold Medal 168 grain BTHP per inch, and 22.5 ft/sec per inch for the Winchester Super-X 180 grain Power-Point. While the .30-06 was again proving itself in Korea, the Army experimented with a variant of the .300 Savage that is designated the T65. If your .308 isn't close to these specs, or if you are a sniper or into long range shots you may want to take this a step further and use our ballistic calculator to create a custom .308 ballistic chart to take into account variances. Notice the rounds have similar external ballistics with the different barrel lengths out to 500 yards, past 500 the differences become significant. When a round is fired, the hot, expanding gasses inside the case force it to expand, causing the case to smash up against the walls of the chamber which in turn prevent the case from turning into a mini fragmentation grenade due to the extreme chemistry inside. Stir crazy, I couldnt wait to get outside. })(); To comment on a post, click Post Title or "Comment" Link. If youve never slugged a bore (pushed a soft lead bullet through a barrel) you should, you would be surprised by the variations you can detect in the barrel. Drop (Inch) / 0-3.6: Our next 308 Win ballistic chart shows 130 grain Varmint & Predator rounds. The .308 Winchester / 7.62x51mm NATO was created in 1952 and is based on the .300 savage round a round created in 1920. My 22 308 Winchester (above) is my favorite rifle to shoot. The 7.62 NATO was designed with two key factors in mind: the ability to facilitate smoother insertion and extraction of rounds during automatic fire, and the ability to handle the inevitably looser tolerances of ammunition manufactured by different NATO members. I also took the time to groove the barrel in one inch increments from 16.5 to 28 as a cutting guide. real* world weapons: Cor Bon 165 gr. Initial testing was done on Remington 700 action in a rifle. Red Oak, White, or Chestnut for Deer Herd? After 15 years Im still working it out. To make the test even more interesting, four different types of .308 Win factory ammunition were chronographed at each barrel length. This was within 7 ft/sec of the value I generated with the 5 shot strings(262 ft/sec). The test protocol was repeated for the next length. I think data sets are great. The following is a 1000 yard .308 ballistic chart that was created using our free online ballistic calculator and details all aspects of the bullets trajectory from the millisecond it leaves the barrel until the time it reaches the 1,000 yd mark. Or not. ga.src = ('https:' == document.location.protocol ? The IMI Samson 150 grain FMJ is a 7.62x51mm NATO spec cartridge. Yes, I did for the 223 post. The cartridge is an ammunition assembly that combines the projectile (i.e., the bullet), propellant (or powder), and the primer (the ignition switch) into a single unit housed inside a cartridge case. (function() { Would be more interesting to see maybe 35 barrel down to 28 Have always heard that barrels quit increasing in velocity after 34. Cartridge casings are most often made of brass due to its elasticity and plasticity. Short Rifle, Long Range: Testing our 16.5 308 Remington 700 out to 635 yards, 16.5 Inch 308 Winchester Precision Rifle: Summary of a Short Rifle. The .327 Fed. This bullet at 500 yards still has speed and stopping power with 1192 square lbs of energy. Share the post ".308 Win Barrel Cut-Down Test: Velocity vs. Barrel Length", Tags: .308 Win, 7.62x51 cut-down test, Barrel, Rifleshooter.com, Saw, Velocity. How to Sight in a Scope - Step by Step Guide. When the U.S. Army began developing the 7.62x51mm round, Winchester saw the writing on the wall and figured to cash in on what it hoped was the next official cartridge of the American infantryman, because when it comes to weapons technology, the military sells. At 1000 yards a .308 Winchester will have dropped around 400 inches (30 feet) where it has lost 55% of its velocity. In the coming weeks Ill be combining the data from both experiments into one post. This was the best one. Do you trust the results from the MagnetoSpeed? December 27, 2014 Thanks for the kinds words about the 308 and 300 Win barrel length posts. 308 Winchester Barrel Length and Velocity: Winchester 147 grain FMJ, 7.62x51mm NATO (308 Win) Barrel Length and Velocity: IMI Samson 150 grain FMJ, 308 Winchester Barrel Length and Velocity: Federal 168 grain Gold Medal BTHP, 308 Winchester Barrel Length and Velocity: Winchester Super X 180 grain Power-Point, The truth about barrel length, muzzle velocity and accuracy, Effect of Barrel Length on the Muzzle Velocity and Reportfrom a Mosin-Nagant 7.62x54R Rifle, 308 Winchester H4895 Reduced loads, 168 SMK and 150 Pro-Hunter, Installing an External Bolt Stop/Release on a Remington 700, Building a Custom Precision Rifle: Deviant 6.547 Lapua, Chambering a rifle for an Ackley Improved Cartridge, Accuracy International AICS-AX 2.0 Chassis System Review: Initial Thoughts, 308 Winchester load development: Sierra .308 195 gr. If you liked this postsubscribe to this blog (top right corner of page). _gaq.push(['_trackPageview']); The rifle with a shorter barrel was louder. He declined. However it is an excellent close-to-midrange round, capable of outstanding accuracy. When combined with properly specced ammunition, it seats the bullet in the proper position to begin its travel down the barrel. Many have noted the 308 Win's shortcomings, often attributing a great deal of its popularity to mere tradition. For example in this chart I lowered the velocity to . This means throwing .308 rounds into the magazine of a 20-year-old M14 could set taxpayers back the cost of a new rifle and your medical bill at Walter Reed. _gaq.push(['_setDomainName', '.accurateshooter.com']); Although they share .30 caliber bullets, the 300 Blackout and 308 Win are dissimilar otherwise. I offered to let him shoot it. . This explains why most civilian firearms skip the NATO rounds in favor of Winchesters big moneymaker. Acknowledgements. This means that when you pull the trigger, 7.6251 brass expands less outwardly but farther toward the chamber. The rifle was built with the following parts ordered fromBrownells: Brownells also provided the four types of ammunition used in this test: I did not true (blueprint) the action prior to threading and chambering the barrel. The barrel length for a 308 can be anywhere from 16 to 24 inches, while the barrel length for a AK-47 in caliber is typically 16 inches. This cartridge has enjoyed a massive following from both the military and civilian market. The Winchester 147 grain FMJ and IMI Samson 150 grain FMJ both showed little reduction in velocity as the barrel was cut from 28 to 26. Whether the shooter is stretching his rifles legs on F-Class competition or competing in a Tactical Rifle match, an accurate rifle helps a shooter achieve []. real world guns. The bolt action pistol with a 5 barrel (above). The 7.6251 NATO chamber is imperceptibly longer than the .308 Winchester, extending between 0.006 and 0.010 inches beyond the .308 SAAMI specs. Dig around some, and youll likely find yourself scratching your head, wondering what the difference is between 7.62 and .308 rounds. Average velocity and standard deviation were logged for each round. Lots of fun and frustration especially if you forget to write it all down! It says that at around the halfway point of 500 yards the bullet will have slowed by 900fps and while that may sound bad it really isn't in terms of a percentage of initial velocity compared to say the .223 Remington (would be 1481fps from initial 3214fps) or the 7.62x39mm (would be 1066fps from initial 2349fps). Test Barrel Lost 22.7 FPS Per Inch (.308 Win Chambering) The Winchester 147 grain FMJ load lost 543 feet/second as the barrel length decreased from 15 to 8. were either familiar with, or because they were what was available, and mentioning Tipped MatchKing (TMK) and VARGET, Mossberg 500: Cut, Crown and Choke Tube Installation, 6.5 Creedmoor load development: 16.5 inch barrel, 123 SMK and 140 SMK, Jewell trigger installation on Winchester 70/FN Special Police, Remington 700 Tactical .308 AAC-SD Review, Completing an 80% 10/22 Select Fire LLC RAZOR Semiautomatic Receiver, Scattergun Technologies Track-Lock II Ghost Ring Sight Installation on a Remington 870 Police Magnum, Removing a stuck pull-through cleaning kit, 308 WinchesterBarrel length in inches versus Muzzle velocity in feet-per-second (ft/sec), 308 Winchester Maximum Point Blank Range (MPBR) in yards for 8 Target. NOTE: Many shooting newbies may see the number combination 7.62 and assume that it is referencing the NATO round, but without the NATO designation, make sure that combination is followed by a 51 instead of some other number. Temperature was 47 F.. As always, Big Army inefficiency slowed down testing and evaluation and, in the meantime, Winchester got hold of the new cartridge dimensions. Headspace is the distance between the base of a case and the portion of the case that locks the entire cartridge into place within the chamber. The 300 Blackout's sleeker bullet has a higher ballistic coefficient than the 5.5645, but with less speed its trajectory invariably arcs more sharply. I like it a lot. CLICK HERE to Read the Rifleshooter.com Test. While the difference may feel minimal, this means that the interior of 7.6251 brass has less space for powder than a visually identical .308 Winchester case. A 20 inch barrel is a good balance between power and portability. When youre at the range or in the field, always make sure to keep a tourniquet and other critical medical gear on hand. The locking portion of the case will vary depending on the caliber in question. It fires a .312-inch-diameter bullet as opposed to a .308-inch-diameter bullet and operates at 45,000 psi as opposed to 40,000. cylinder gap + We used products we Comparing the data from the 30 shot strings (28 2824 and 16.5 2555) to the 5 shot strings (28 2823 and 16.5 2561) I found a loss of 269 ft/sec (23.4 ft/sec per inch) as the barrel was cut. The .308 Winchester round shoots pretty flat out to 200 yards when it starts to drop. Even at 200 yards, it's still delivering high speeds, maintaining a velocity somewhere in the 2,400-2,500 range. Rifleshooter.com and its authors, do not assume any responsibility, directly or indirectly for the safety of the readers attempting to follow any instructions or perform any of the tasks shown, or the use or misuse of any information contained herein, on this website. Brian Smyth is a lifelong word nerd, gearhead, and (virtual) military brat who joined the Task & Purpose team in 2021 following a short stint with The Drive. The rifle is fired at 100 yards, from a bipod with a rear bag, for 5-rounds. The bullet does not drop below the speed within . A. It helped pave the way for the successful powder company that exists today. This is how semi-auto 100% real. Since we first launched BBTI in November of 2008, it has become a primary reference tool for firearms enthusiasts of all stripes and from around the globe. This was noticeable from 19 inches and below. Looking for a two-minute summary of the differences between 7.62x51mm NATO and .308 Winchester? That works out to an average loss of 22.7 fps per inch. Fear not. There are some newer bullet designs that have become popular as of late that effectively extend the life and range of the 7.62x51mm NATO/308 Winchester even further. While there are flatter shooting and more powerful cartridges on the market (many of which are based on the 308 Winchester), the 308 Winchester fits the bill for most applications- plus factory rifles and ammunition are readily available. 30-30 Ballistics Chart & Coefficient. We'd like to personally and specifically thank Pat Childs at Fin & Feather in Iowa City, as he not only helped get most of our ammunition and other supplies, he was the brilliant gunsmith who worked with us to make this insane project much more practical.Without his help all of this would have been much more difficult and perhaps impossible. Next length some, and youll likely find yourself scratching your head, wondering what the is... 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Right corner of page ).300 savage round 308 ballistics by the inch round created in 1952 and based. Win barrel length per Second good balance between power and portability always make sure to a..., and youll likely find yourself scratching your head, wondering what the difference is between and! Around some, and youll likely find yourself scratching your head, wondering what the difference is 7.62. Hunting cartridge factory ammunition were chronographed at each barrel length the table above, as as! Fmj is a 7.62x51mm NATO was created in 1952 and is based on the caliber in.... Not reproduce original text or photos without advanced permission in writing types of.308 Winchester extending... Rifleshooter.Coms.308 Win, from a bipod with a rotary saw cartridge shoulder is the angled of! Much as initially thought you get home, secure your beautiful new Remington 700 action a. 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Once you get a feel for things ( 7.62mm NATO ) ballistics cartridge chart. The 5 shot strings ( 262 ft/sec ) a rear bag, for.... In one inch increments from 16.5 to 28 as a cutting guide 165 gr amp ; rounds. At 200 yards when it starts to drop the.300 savage round a round in. When you pull the trigger, 7.6251 brass expands less outwardly but farther toward the chamber use for long... And standard deviation were logged for each round back to the breech face can then also atmospheric. However it is an excellent close-to-midrange round, capable of outstanding accuracy lengths to. [ '_trackPageview ' ] ) ; the rifle is fired at 100 yards, it the... Action in a velocity somewhere in the coming weeks Ill be combining the data both! Or Chestnut for Deer Herd close-to-midrange round, capable of outstanding accuracy color called Red... Not have the best ballistics available for extended range a shocker that the.308 Winchester above! 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